Потомок Николая I на войне дронов: от штурмовика до командира беспилотного полка

The great-great-grandson of Emperor Nicholas I

Источник: https://scottritter.substack.com/p/the-great-great-grandson-of-emperor

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Hello and welcome to this special edition of the Russia House with Scott Ritter. Today I find myself in Moscow where I'm seeing the city, seeing Russia. I just came back from the St. Petersburg International Economic Forum, heard President Putin speak. One of the topics that was brought up during the question and answer period was the issue of drones and drone warfare and how it has changed not just military affairs but also you know deeper you know political issues how do nations deal with drones how do they deal with the fact that these weapons that are very precise are striking civilian targets do we need laws rules regulations these are deep questions and there couldn't be a better person to talk to than my guest today Gavril Doroshin first of all thank you very much for coming let's just start off with that when I look at you though I'm a student of Russian history and when I look at you I have a feeling that I've gone back in time and then I'm staring at I don't know somebody say Nicholas the first former czar tell us a little bit about your background you know you I'll let you tell it tell your story who are you what's your history what's your relationship with maybe a former czar and how you got to be where you are today in Russia

I would like to be really very brief. I'm very young. I'm a French guy. I was born in Marseille in a Russian-speaking family and I was growing up according to the Russian rules. My parents told me, please be grateful. to France but don't forget about your rules and when I remember 2013 2014 the Maiden Square in Kyiv I also looked at the geopolitical things on there and when the operation was launched by the ukrainian army i was 17 years old and i really wanted to become one year old and when i became 18 i bought a ticket a king the ticket and i came to donetsk to fight my age of 18 was something what i did as a young man i really was too brave or over brave but i had some political beliefs at that time as well and i really wanted to use my sword for my own And as for my former, my history, it definitely plays quite a significant role, but it plays a significant role for myself. I would like to be really at the same level as my former.

because all i think was done all the terrorists with that who were belonging to russian empire too and now they are going back to the russian returning to the Russian Federation and that's it was a great work done my informers and I really wanted to do the same here it is for me it was quite an important role because I really understood what what they did and i really want to be at the same level just to be clear

though you say your formers You mean the Tsar, the former royal family of Russia. You're related, you're a direct relationship to Tsar Nicholas I. Is this correct?

yes you are absolutely right probably that's the eighth level the daughter of Nikolaus the first she got married a Maximilian de Bougarnet who was the grandchild of Josephine of de Bougarnet who was the wife civil wife of the Napoleon and Evgeny de Bogarnay who was actually fighting against Russia in 1812 and in Zvenigret by near Moscow there is a monastery and Evgeny Bogarnay I saw in his dream a saint who told me that if he would have lived this monastery as it is he would stay in Russia in there and the ancestors would live in Russia and they listened to this a saint in his dream and that's how it is now I'm here this is almost like

a fairy tale it's uh I mean it's it's it's like a script from a Hollywood movie uh you know the ghost of russia passes rises and and comes to save russia from you know a new threat but it's reality it's it's the truth you uh You could speak about swinging a sword for this, but you didn't swing a sword. You carried a rifle. When you showed up here, you went to the front. You served as a frontline soldier, an assault trooper. How was that? How was it to go from Marseille being a civilian to traveling to Donetsk, to the Donbass, and suddenly being thrust into a war? You weren't trained for it, right? You're not somebody who had military experience. You came here and you went to war. How was that for you? How was that transition?

Please listen. When I was growing up, I was reading Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, Lermontov, and other writers and poem writers who used to be also soldiers. and i was really inspired by them and i don't see that it's not really strange in the modern world it's a material world i'm really far away from it but if your heart burns and you as a young man have a A burning heart, you really want to do something that's a very normal thing when you're young because you always want to change the entire world, you always like to have justice everywhere and I got this chance to do it. I had no military background no military experience I really wanted to be a photographer I was actually doing this the related studies and when the war started I decided to do something to test myself so I bought a ticket and I became a machine gun operator. I was in a reconnoissance officer spent there two years until 2017.

Then I went back to France and returned to the special military operation. And you know it on your experience, the best experience you can get is on the front line in action.

When you arrived, did... The other fighters for Donetsk, did they know about your background? Did they treat you any differently? Or were you just another soldier on the front?

I was just considered as a common, as usual fighter, as a brother of these guys in the front line. I never was talking about my history. Usually I didn't talk it to anyone this information became public in 2022 when i gave my first interview but my within the first two years and one was nobody knew about it but i didn't see any meaning in that because i really wanted to have a clear line and to live according to my honor

Now, when you came here in 2015, the Donbas was still officially part of Ukraine. And so you were fighting for the Donetsk People's Republic. It wasn't Russia. It was a Russian part of I guess you could say Rusayin the larger Russia but you weren't fighting as part of the Russian Federation but when you returned in 2022 it's a different story we're now talking about the Donbass being Russia fighting for Russia you were a volunteer the first time what's your status today are you a volunteer are you a contract soldier what's your relationship with the Russian military today

When I was actually in the first two years, I was a volunteer. We had the so-called military guards by the Donetsk People's Republic. That was the people's militia. So I was within the Militia so within this first two years I was in this Donetsk Militia but now when the special military operation started I was working in a private company which was a volunteers corp I spent there of two years and I'm currently dealing with it I'm doing the development of drones but as a civilians I'm not a soldier at the moment since May 2024

Well, let's move on into the drone warfare aspect of it. How did you become involved in drone warfare? When you arrived in 2022, you had experience as a machine gun operator, an assault soldier. Why didn't you just return to that? How did you transition into drones? What happened that made you a drone operator?

When I came back to Donbas to the military special military operation, I used to be a striker and a machine gun operator and I spent six months fighting as a machine gun operator. Unfortunately, the front line led me to change my role when we were actually attacking Evdivka and we lost a lot of soldiers there. Even our unit was not able to continue of the fight. When I entered the industrial zone in Avdivq, we were 24 guys and only eight of them returned back. And then our commander said that he had no to send you for another strike and send us tea for the drone operator training course we got two first drones they were very small scoured drones and we started watching YouTube videos videos in order to make military drones out of these small drones in our first experience was in March 2023 when we started dropping grenades from these Mavic drones that's my career as the Drone Operator so I spent six months at the strike fighter then I started going undergoing this drone operator training then I started the drone operator then became a commander of my unit and a commander of a bigger group and now that's a full regiment not a single unit we're talking about

a revolution in military affairs When your commander pulled you out of a divka and and sent you to the drone school was this drone school something that your local unit had come up with it or was it a drone school that the Russian military had I mean who who is driving drone warfare early on was this something that the Russian military said you must learn how to use drones or was this a local initiative by your your commander

that was a local initiative when I was there with these FVP drones which I used that's a pure civil drones and then the military industry joined and started manufacturing not only scout drones but also fighting drone fighters and but this small drones that's were sports drawn in the very beginning it was just an idea of someone on the front line to try it and something what we see now that's the result of initiative made by enthusiasts on the front line because they wanted to save their lives and to kill enemies at a distance

But I think this is a fascinating aspect of drone warfare because today, you know, as I said, we speak of it as a revolutionary military affairs. That means this is a technology that's changing the very nature of war. But it begins as a local initiative by by soldiers. It's not like the government said in the past, you know, build machine guns, give them to the soldiers. Here the soldiers said we're we're using drones and the government Wasn't even aware of it I guess when it first started this was a local initiative this means you changed your tactics and normally militaries don't like their units to change tactics you're you're trained in a specific way a specific style of assault specific communication support and suddenly at the local levels you're you're changing it on your own you've decided that the tactics don't work that you're going to modify your tactics you're going to bring in a new weapon how did your command deal with this I mean what what was the dynamic between the soldiers at the front and and the military command in the rear as they watched you unilaterally change

the way you fight war I would like to give you a very brief answer we talk about the drones that they are our future and I don't think that if you drones are the future drones is our present or even our past because if you say that the future is a kind of war in space how we can use these satellites laser equipment that's something what we need to start about right now because as for drones we can see they can be operate how they work because we have also different systems supporting the drone war but it's something what we already know but in the future there will be a next level because the drone war is something what we're having right now and we started developing the drone equipment very late we are currently occurring to take over as for the use of drones we used to work in a following way the most talented operators who were sent to the front line plus two or three beginners and experienced operators who were sharing their experience because we need quite a long time to prepare a good drone operator it shouldn't be just someone who can really lift the drone and go with this drone somewhere because we need a real operator that can use a drone and succeed in it and we need also really save these people and these drone operators should get a real experience on the front line and then should come back to the drone to teach or to train the new one new operators and the drones should be used also with reconnaissance service so with the communication with the other military means and in this case Drones can make not single strikes it could be a complete system when everything is interconnected and that when it works so interconnected will be good now we start using AI and we are currently using and developing new AI based technologies so the world is really changing very So in this case we need also to develop the scout, the defense drones and the striking drones because when you were in St.

Pete not so long ago you were also aware of the drone attacks against St. Pete facilities so we need also to develop our defense drones

as well Well it's interesting because again we're just break it down I guess piece piece by piece you know when it I think as you're aware when the when the conflict started back in 2014 2015 when you were a machine gunner and assault you use traditional Soviet era tactics infantry intensive armor operating direct support artillery firing and support those tactics don't exist today I when I when I look at the what's going on the front line I don't see you know 60 soldiers advancing in support I see three soldiers two soldiers advancing with drone support the mass is gone just a number of soldiers this is a fundamentally different way of of fighting war how did that transition happen who has the Russian government now or the Russian military change their training to reflect this new reality. I mean, how did you convince them to do it? Because you're the ones who made the changes. You weren't told to stop doing the old tactics.

You stopped doing them because you were dying. You change your tactics because the old tactics weren't working. I'm just curious about the transition. How did you how did you go from being trained to do one thing? And if we look to the future, you're doing something completely different. What happened in between?

to make that change it happened even as a blitz of lightning we didn't even see it before January 2023 everything was a it was a classic work we used to use a lot of bottle tanks artillery then in January February and March 2023 that was a key moment then we got this pseudo plot of skies and we got this new development and i think that was quite a rare case i don't really know the military tactics history that was initiated from the bottom not from the top because the armory showed that we need to to make it this way because in the beginning we used our own money in order to finance we also took money out of our so salary in order to buy this small Chinese FPV drones we got this several ritter realscott n13c -inch drones which we purchased on our own money we also found sponsors to do it and then the proof that it was needed today now they go with any government decided to support us in our environment started doing a lot of investments because the drones can be widely used not only on on the front line but also in the civil industries so this transition was very fast within two or three months then we made mistakes because we were not really understanding from the beginning how to use the drones but now it's a drone war

Which side started the drone war first? Did the Ukrainians start using drones first? Did Russia start using drones first? I've spoken to some people who speak of it as a competition, that it's an ongoing competition between Ukraine and Russia as the developments go on and on and on. Who started the drone war?

um i'm really struggling to answer i can really say with a proud that's where we who started the joint war no that is not so the front line was a very dense just 50 meters away between ukrainians and russian troops we were able to see each other and when you start using drones you can see they do it this way or i can do it this way as well i don't know who started first as in the beginning we had a significant advance in the number of scouting drones in 22 23 24 we were actually a much much stronger in our reconnaissance we were able to see more and to see deeper and we had a much more scouting drones as for the striking drones that was probably and parallel because when you work you can also lose the communication you can they were able to get our drones we were able to get their drones we were able to see what they use what we can steal they were able to see what we had what they could steal from us that was a kind of constant exchange I wouldn't say I don't know who started I cannot really answer this question who was the first

but now it's curious because I've I've Read stories and I've heard interviews of people saying just that, that, you know, we took our drone off and the Ukrainians jammed the signal and captured the drone and then they send the drone back to you and you jam the signal and you capture it. So a drone can get used several times by each side, which just shows the parallel development of that. But your tactics evolve and then your equipment evolves. The jamming that you speak of is electronic warfare. What role does electronic warfare play in the operation of drones at the front?

I think that's a very wide question because I'm currently as a civilian who actually did dealing with drones we also received these drones from the front line we see what technical parts are used today manufactured for example in Mexico and France in the Great Britain or Spain it proves that the entire world looks at this and understands the key to a tactical issue in developing the drone technologies. When we started using drones, I don't want to go deep in technology. For example, there was a direct communication between the operator and the drone. We were actually able to stand on the ground and we had our VR glasses in order to have this direct communication with the drone it was absolutely unsafe because the enemies were able to see you that was a non but not correct tactics but we had no other choice now everything is different we have also new antennas new transmitters you can also work from the underground you can be really in a hidden facility you know to operate joint technologies are really very well developed here but in the beginning it was very primitive so now we do see this development more and more and in the beginning the main task was actually to strike the enemies and now we should also to protect our operators because in the beginning we didn't understand the importance of the operators and in the beginning We actually were considering the drone operators as common soldiers.

Now we understand the drone operator is one who needs to go through a six-month course in order to be able to operate drone correctly.

Again, just reading into what you're saying, you start by putting on goggles, standing up and flying the drone directly, direct line of communication, very dangerous it can be jammed and and so you start to develop new tactics that require new support today I would imagine if I were a drone commander that I just don't introduce drones to the battlefield that I have to look at the battlefield I have to look at what I opt what what operations I want to do and then I have to design a drone support plan you said underground cables so somebody has to put the underground cable they're attached to what a a you know a communication relay system that goes to an antenna but the antenna has to be offset from the unit you run a cable to the unit so it's not just drone operators now it's a system of drones it's a system of communications this requires military organization do you have so we're not just talking about a drone operator now we're talking about drone units units that are specifically designed to operate drones on the battlefield is this correct

if i can sum up what you said the one who actually develops the new communication means will win the one who can have the more the safest the best quality communication this one will will win. We talk about the satellite communication, because we talk about the radio communication we have, we are limited in distance communication really matters. So within the next 15 or 20 years, the communication will be one of the main areas of development because currently we have a kind of air fight and this air fight will transit to space fight because we will need to create new means of communication and it will be also military satellites for sure and if you would like to defense ourselves so we need to be able to shoot down the enemy satellites I think really some top officials may started thinking about this space wallet it will be we need even look even higher even further

so you're telling me that it's not a wise investment to do Elon Musk's Starlink that Starlink might come under risk in the future

at the most selling or the most efficient coming mean of communication and will mask should also start a thinking and about investments into another the area because these satellites will be go down that's what it Elon you can thank me later um but that's that's what a short advertisement

All the drones that are being shot down have startling contenders on it. It's not advertised a statement of reality. We've entered into an interesting phase of war where a civilian company plays such an important role in facilitating a major weapon systems, the drones. I mean, they're We can joke about Starlink, but it's a reality. There was a Starlink antenna found on one of the drones that struck the Starbell school. So in a way, Elon Musk is a facilitator of murder. You know, these are things for people to think about. But again, I'm just struck by the fact that, you know, you said early on you bought the drones yourself. And they're not cheap. I mean, I don't make a lot of money. I can't afford a drone at home. I mean, I'd love to have one to fly around my neighborhood, but they're expensive. And yet a drone, when you say FPV drone, that's a first person view drone. And it's been weaponized.

which means you're going to put you know a warhead on it and you're flying it in to destroy it so each one of these drones cost thousands of dollars how did you get the government to wake up to start paying for these drones and were they hesitant at first to allow you to destroy a two thousand dollar piece of equipment um you know because today thousands of drones are used every day uh how did it how did happen that you know people got used to just throwing away money and not throwing away because it's a useful weapon but drone warfare is very expensive it's not cheap

the war of Jones is expensive because it is a steering still in progress still in development is it is being constantly upgrade that's why it is expensive but nevertheless the drone war is is much cheaper than to use the hundreds of thousands of millions of artillery grenades than to lose dozens or hundreds of bottle tanks because the first use of the drones they cost 300 dollars in china and when we you know we striked for the first time on the ukrainian bottle tank t72 with the 300 dollar john and when you show the picture of this striked bottle tank because if you would like to do it with your altery a grenade that needs first of all time needs money and you need also to use five six grenades and in order to shoot a bottle tank and it is not, you may destroy it, not destroy it completely. So drone is a very cheap and high precision weapon as for the distance They are not compared with the missiles, but as for the precision, they can be really compared with the Hymerzoth.eo-caliber missiles and the drones are really high precision weapons and much much cheaper and it's pretty logical that we use them sometimes we are not able to strike from the first time and even if you spend 10 drones in order to shoot a particular target it is worth doing and we also use drones for anti-drone operations because of these standard anti-drone missiles are very expensive.

An FPV drone and every single drone is always cheaper than a missile or a Calibre or a HIMARS missile or even a grenade. It is, I think, very beneficial. beneficial for the army and we don't put all the stakes on drones only it would be a mistake we need to keep a very broad panel of military weapons if we really make all these tanks just on john that's very good but if you don't have any power supply tomorrow the drone won't fly so you need to find a balance what we here currently are doing well speaking of balance

The small Mavic type drones that we're talking about are tactical systems. They're used to support, you know, the frontline units in the tactical fight. But we see other drones that are doing deeper strikes. There's the Lancet, I believe, is a Russian loiter drone. There's another one, the Malodbanaya. It's another strike drone. These were developed, I think, by the Russian military. And so we have something curious happening. because tactics blend into operations. The local fight blends into the deep fight and they must be coordinated. And so we see the push down of drones from the government, the mid-range loiter drones advancing to meet the tactical FPV drones to meld together, to make a singularity of drone doctrine. How did that happen? How did you get... the government and the local people to come together the local soldiers to come together and unify their their tactics their doctrine because the Lancet today isn't it's almost a tactical system itself it's an expendable round of ammunition but it's pushed down by the government how did that unification take place

As for the Landsat, it is a very interesting drone. It is using also the data provided by other drones and the Landsat also using not only the drone navigation data from other drones, but also other drones to communicate with the operator. I would like to give you an example about the drones, how we systemize them, how we coordinate their operation. and there was a case it was in the Parisia in the Parisian region I wasn't personally involved I just the story I heard we started using big drones they can fly for two or three kilometers and then we also lifted up smaller drones the scouting drones they can fly up to five kilometers and we also used ground drones we don't really talk much about it but we also use the ground-based drones so we have three or four ground-based drones the small tanks and they usually use heavier machine a gun around 1000 munitions and they were a task was actually not only to strike the enemies and the task of this ground-based drones actually to attract attention and the small tanks started shooting, they also started striking even more and the Ukrainians started fighting against them and everything were actually paying attention to them.

because they also had a lot of nomad a lot of noise a lot of fume and small striker groups started actually coming to a particular positions so the Jones can also can in support the infantry and the strikers it was a very good example how we can use the Jones who because the Jones can really add to attract attention in order to give some free space for other for other military to move the drones can be used also for their logistic purposes in order to supply ammunition food and water so the drones can be is used in very different ways and I do and I think it we will also be doing it even more often now currently are trying to systemize the drones activity even we have also the new Army units and all drone units and even the infantry the artillery also need drone support now have a lot of programs developed for example you were able to watch the artillery grenade you were able to correct and now you can really with a drone understand what target was heated by grenade and you can also give more exact navigation data to the artery so in drone Drone means that you have initiative you are mobile and you are faster so the speed and mobility are two key factors of a drone what we didn't have in the beginning of this military special military operation so drone means This means that you are always mobile, you are always fast, and on the other side, the enemy is doing the same.

And the enemy can also see almost everything, can see even very deep into your position. for example as we talk about logistics but now it a military in our back we don't have it because the drones can fly even until Tumen or Perm so you cannot really feel you 100% safe if being 100 kilometers away from the front line and now a task is actually to bring this air fight to the Ukrainian territory

You spoke of the drones collecting information to help target the Landsat drone, but Russia continues to use artillery, rocket artillery, standard gun artillery, but it seems that the the day of mass fires is is finished that what's happening now is that the artillery fires have precision control operational control being provided by a drone overhead who developed this this concept was it the artillery asking for the drones to provide the targeting or was it the people flying the drone saying hey we have targets we need artillery how did you marry up artillery with drones

I think this initiative was actually by the drone units in 2015 when I was in the reconnaissance area officer we had actually to correct the artillery fire and we used to look what was happening we were correct correcting the fire but then we understood that we can use the small drones in order to navigate the artificial so we started telling the authorities that we can provide them the required target datum in the beginning it was through the radio or telegram and then we asked to develop as dedicated system now we have several dedicated systems for this purpose that That was a natural demand because you see what is actually more efficient, more comfortable, and you don't need to wait for anyone to give a comment. I think who was the first, not the artillery ones. It was just the common sense.

There's a new development that we see because so far we're talking about drones that are using communications, standard drones. electronic communications, etc. But if you look at photographs of the battlefield today, you see shiny filament wires everywhere, fiber optic controlled drones. Who came up with this innovation? Did the Ukrainians start using fiber optics first? Did the Russians? And what would you say the mix is between FPV drones? What percentage today are you using fiber optics and what percentage are using standard electronic communications?

As for we have different categories of drones they are actually low medium and long range drones they have their own benefits if you talk about the long range drones here ukrainians have an advantage because they have this starlink communication which gives them an opportunity to fly for long distances and we're not able to do it at the moment when when we started using Starlink communication as well it was blocked for us it was not so critical because we find also other ways how to do it I don't want to tell you the secrets of the details best for the fiber optics we were the first one who started using the fiber optics to operate the drones especially for the a low range low range means up to 20 kilometers then we have the medium range up to 200 kilometers and then we have a long range drones over 200 kilometers as for the radio communication it is not really stable it can be really shut down by the enemy that's why we start using the fiber optics because as for the fiber office you have to cut the cable otherwise that's a very good temporary solution it could be used up to 50 kilometers however there are so-called gray zones it's a neutral zone on the front line for example we were able actually to strike the of tanks within five kilometers but now we don't have any bottle tanks within 15 kilometers from the front line everything all this military equipment is further back so in this case these targets are much far from us that's in the beginning so we need to adopt every single time every single type of drone has its advantages and disadvantages As for the long-range drones, the Ukrainians have now currently advancing.

As for the lower-middle range, we are better.

When we, again, just speaking of the development of drone warfare, we see... some specialized units developing. For instance, on the Russian side, it's well known that there's the Rubicon Center that has been redefining drone warfare, developing new tactics, new equipment, and they have a reputation for hunting down Ukrainian drones to be being brought into a sector of the front and and destroying the Ukrainian ability to wage war. We see Dmitry Rogozhin opening up Bar Sarmat outside of Melitopol, again, a drone development center. You yourself, I believe it's not a secret, we're affiliated with the Birovesnik unit and Is this a drone operating center itself? You spoke about how the unit grew from being some drone operators to a small squad to a battalion to a regiment. Today it's a regiment sized unit. Do you develop your own technologies or do you link with other centers like Rubicon and Bar Sarmat?

As for on the ground, we also cooperate with everyone. But in the very beginning, when I said that was our personal initiative, initiative of our soldiers and and their links with some sponsors and those who actually saw this potential at that time and everyone had his own sponsors and supporters for example we were in Bahamut and Zaporozhi they had another approach and we had also different requirements at that time however with the time we understood that we started facing the following problem everyone was going his own way and there was no real interaction sometimes we were actually disturbing each other for example was an interception of even though Russian signals and then we understood we need to create one integrated network to communicate and to cooperate then we had some private companies who joined us and the best ideas related to joining They seemed to be very strange in the beginning.

For example, nobody actually could imagine a couple years ago that we could use the fiber optical cables with drones and all these ideas. The thing is they usually come from our soldiers on the front line and also give this very important feedback to the drone technology developers and drone makers and everyone is trying to collect the required information to develop those technologies which can meet the soldiers need big needs because the enemy is doing the same results is because it's constantly upgrading its drones and we need to be even battered and the speed matters here we need to find the right technology writing on technical components in Russia or abroad we need to buy them to use it to test it and to use it in the on the front line we used to make this test operation of a new technologies first but for example if you develop any technology technology is very good for the first three or four months that you need to upgrade this technology that's the constant upgrade process even you have a very good system in about six months this system is not really good at and the enemy will do everything to make it soon and sometimes we can also come back to the previous technologies what we did in the past and sometimes we may have new technologies in the old technology which seems to be good again can should be adopted to the new ones used so in these cases for the dynamics we import technologies we develop our own components and this the interconnection between the economy policy and the war and now the Actually the scale is so huge, we need also the governmental willingness in order to get the finance, we need to also cooperate with other countries, with different companies in order to create a very small result on the front line.

When we speak of drone warfare, I mean, again, it's Ukraine versus Russia. This is the primary battlefield. But today we have Europe saying that Germany saying they're going to prepare for war with Russia by 2029. The British claim they want to prepare for war against Russia by 2030. The United States was rotating in a heavy armored brigade. you know the primary American strike force and in people in America believe that you know the superiority of supremacy of the United States military will you know dominate any future battlefield what's the life expectancy of a heavy armored brigade going up against the Russian army today using your your drone tactics do you do you feel that the United States will roll over you with their mass tanks and their massed artillery fires? Or is drone warfare something that the United States doesn't even understand yet and will have a detrimental impact on our military if we choose to fight a war against Russia?

first of all I need to we need to understand it is pretty well known that all the subest and the countries they send their military experts to Ukraine you know understand how the milk Ukrainian military uses drones because the of the use of BPLR. It's not the exclusive benefit of Russia and Ukraine. It is not correct to think that this technology is used by Ukraine and Russia only. Germany, France, the United States have this technology, may also have better technology the technologies that we have and if we have to fight in these conditions they will be able to do it because they develop and they manufacture this technology as we understand ukraine is not overly he's not able to develop these technologies to assemble these components because on the because the military industrial NATO complex is working for Ukraine and it is good a very good test facility for them for these technologies because on one you may have a technology and you may assume how it works but that another thing is to have a political will to go on the war and you have must have also prepared army for it because the drone war means not only that you have operators sitting on a very good underground position but it also have a work in very complicated conditions if we for example a fight against a certain African group in Africa that's one thing but if we have a really two conventional armies with a lot of soldiers and if you Lufia the initiatives there will be a very positional war that's a real hell because you don't have enough food you are not able to wash yourself you don't have the right rotation the logistics is disturbed 3 weeks on the front line I wasn't even able to take a shower there because you only survived there and I'm not sure that the NATO armies are ready to fight in this condition as for the technologies they do have these technologies they are able to be technologically advanced but i'm not sure that they can really fight in the conditions i mentioned but we need to think about it because i personally don't believe that nato and the european union that unlocked 90 billion dollars for ukraine would just lose this money they would like to probably invest this money and we russians shouldn't have not any illusions we won't be left away with the pressure will be on us even in the future this will be the hybrid war it means that the media and the battlefield war will take place which we should be ready for that and we need also to prepare our own people for that and the faster we understand it and the faster we can get ready for that the better we can defense ourselves and fight the enemy I'm talking about the Baltic states for example I don't say that we should go there but we should be ready for that

I want to thank you very much for this conversation I could go on forever it's of great interest to me unfortunately we've run out of time for this particular podcast but it's just been an honor and a privilege to talk to you to meet you to hear your story and to learn from you about this and I think it's important for everybody who's watching this program you know most of the people watching this program are civilians we you know we sit back and we let others do the fighting for us we need to understand though that war is changing it's far more complicated than than it was it's far more deadly than it was and Well, it's fascinating to hear about the developments on the battlefield. It's our job as civilians to try and prevent wars so that people like Gabriel don't have to fight wars, that they can live with their families and live in peace. So view this podcast as an education on the horror of war and the necessity of peace.

I thank you for joining me on this episode of The Rush House with Scott Ritter. And until next time, have a good day.